Sipping Stories: The Secrets and Surprises Hidden in Your Cup of Tea

Tricia:

This is the Mealtime, Magic and Mayhem podcast. I'm Tricia Clark, your host, cooking coach and kitchen mentor. We're here to talk about all things food, wine, travel, cocktails and mealtime memories. So many memories are made around the table. We all know mealtime can be stress full, full of chaos and mayhem. But it's also the universal connector, a catalyst for communication and connection and a time to create magic and memories. So many of our memories are tied to food, and I can't wait to share some of those stories with you here. I'm here to share ideas, inspiration and stories to help you experience mealtime with a dash of magic and just a sprinkle of mayhem.

Tricia:

You can expect new episodes weekly, including a mixture of interviews, personal stories and some fun conversations about our adventures and misadventures in the kitchen and around the table. I hope you walk away feeling inspired to try something new in your kitchen or around your table to create more connection with your friends, family and beyond. Thanks for being here. So welcome to another episode of the Mealtime, Magic and Mayhem podcast. I am welcoming Nicole Wilson on as our guest today to talk about all things tea. I love tea. I love to mix tea in cocktails. I haven't really ventured into baking or cooking with it, but I love drinking tea.

Tricia:

It's a nice way to calm down at the end of the night. There was a while I gave up coffee and just solely immersed myself in drinking tea. And so to find somebody who has all this knowledge about tea and all these different ways to use it is pretty exciting to me. I'm excited to talk to you today, Nicole. I'm going to tell you a little bit about her and then Nicole's going to say hi and we'll move on with our interview. Nicole is a tea writer and educator who's been sharing her love of the leaf online for more than a decade. Her website, Teaformeeplease.com, is the longest continuously running tea blog written by a female author. That's pretty cool.

Tricia:

In: 2018

Nicole:

So much for having me.

Tricia:

So I love to start every conversation, every interview with a fun icebreaker question. And my favorite question this week is if you could only take one CD for a cross country road trip, which would you choose?

Nicole:

so I would definitely say her: 1999

Tricia:

A more recent Swifty. But yeah, I'm really loving the new album, though. Here's where I'm not great with remembering her albums, but there was the last one that she came out with during the pandemic, the Sweater song, help Me Out Here. I can't remember the name of the album.

Nicole:

I'm planking on the name too, but I know exactly the one you mean.

Tricia:

Yeah, but some of the more recent ones. That's where I really started listening to her and kind of falling in love with her music is probably the last three albums, I would say. All right, so let's get started. I have so many questions. I think a decade of tea exploration is seriously impressive. And if anybody could see her on video, the collection of tea and teapots and tea cups behind her is truly epic. I wish I had a place to store that many. But what initially drew you into this enchanting world of tea? And how has your journey from tea enthusiast to educator and writer kind of evolved over the years?

Nicole:

send me packages with, like,: 2030

Nicole:

I actually started my blog initially as a way to back up the writing I was doing for that, and it kind of took on a life of its own after that.

Tricia:

That's really interesting because I do feel like that's kind of how you stumble across tea. Like, you've grown up with bagged tea forever and the stuff you buy en masse at the store, but when you discover loose leaf tea, it really is. I know it sounds silly and ridiculous if you're not familiar, but loose leaf tea is a totally different ballgame and the flavors are so much richer. I think the other thing surprising for me, as I was learning about tea, is tea can really be anything, right? Like, it's made from all sorts of herbs, fruits, spices, not specifically just tea leaves.

Nicole:

Well, that's the interesting thing. A lot of people don't realize that tea is an actual plant, so it's technically only tea if it's made from the camellia synesis. And that's what all of your green tea, black tea, all those teas come from that same plant. So in the industry, that plant we refer to as an herbal tea or a tea to kind of differentiate it from what we would call a true tea, which would be made from the camellia synepsis.

Tricia:

So why do they call them all tea? That's misleading.

Nicole:

I think it's kind of like how all tissues are called kleenex, that it just kind of became like a common phrasing.

Tricia:

Yeah. Interesting. I was always curious about that. Really curious about that. So here's an interesting question for you. If tea could talk, which fascinating historical moment or cultural tradition, would it spill the beans about? Yeah.

Nicole:

So there's a lot to choose from there. Tea is involved in many major world events over time. Definitely. I would say one of the most interesting is tea originated in China, and the Opium War with England and China basically happened because of tea. Once Britain had their taste of tea and they wanted to keep drinking it, they were buying it with silver, which wasn't great for their pocketbooks, so they decided to try to tea for opium instead. And so the reason why the Opium War happened in the first place was because Britain really wanted tea, but they didn't want to pay for it.

Tricia:

That's fascinating. I had no idea. Man, there's so much interesting history there. So are there any surprising stories in your studies of tea that have really stuck with you? When I think about those traditions, for me and my business is all about bringing people together and kind of that breaking bread, share a couple of others that you feel like kind of really speak to that connection piece.

Nicole:

Yeah, absolutely. Tea is the world's most consumed beverage after water. So it really is something that's enjoyed and celebrated by every culture in the world, practically. But the most interesting thing for me, especially as a tea lover, is that they all do it differently. If you compare how they drink tea in India, to how they drink tea in Japan, to how they drink tea in Sri Lanka, there's so many different ways to make tea, have tea, celebrate tea, joy it. And so, for me, I love that my love for tea connects me to all of those different cultures around the world.

Tricia:

Do you have a favorite preparation from one of those cultures? Like, if you found a couple that you're like, I really like it this way, even though I know you might like them all. But do you have a couple of go tos?

Nicole:

I'm definitely a big fan of Fu style brewing, which typically comes from China and Taiwan. Basically, instead of using a big teapot like you would think of kind of how they brew a tea. In England, you use very small brewing vessels to make lots of concentrated infusions, and so it just really emphasizes the aromas of the tea and the flavors of the tea and really gets you up close and personal with the leaves instead of just dumping them into an infuser or something like that. There's lots of different ways to make tea, and that's not the best way for every type of tea, but it's definitely become one of my go to ways to brew.

Tricia:

I guess it makes sense. We think about cooking. Like, there's so many different cuisines and styles of cooking. Never really occurred to me that there would be so many different ways that you could prepare tea and that that would be culturally driven as well. All right, so you've written a book, right, called The Tea Recipe Book. Could you spill the tea on one must try recipe from your book that you think is an absolute crowd pleaser, even among those that maybe aren't quite in pasture.

Nicole:

Yeah. So the recipe that I find goes over the best with pretty much everyone is a recipe for matcha lemon sugar cookies. They're really wonderfully, like, sweet and chewy, but you have the matcha green tea in there that gives it, like, a bit of a balance, too, so they're not too sweet. And even my husband, who hates green tea, eats all of those cookies when I make them.

Tricia:

Those sound amazing. I don't think I've ever had I just bought some shortbread cookies recently that were lavender, Earl Gray, but I haven't had matcha in cookies yet. Kids love that matcha green tea. Is it mochi mochi, those little ice cream?

Nicole:

Oh, yeah.

Tricia:

My kids love matcha. It's the green tea flavored kit Kats, all those things. They end up wanting to try it's, definitely. So I'll have to try those cookies. And I'm sure we'll include a link to your book in the show notes, and we'd love to include that recipe.

Nicole:

Absolutely.

Tricia:

So I was talking to somebody yesterday. We were having a discussion about all things cocktails, and it came up that one of her favorite cocktails that she's created uses a lavender, and she uses lavender and Earl Grey tea combined with whiskey. So it seems like Earl Grey gets a lot of love out there. You see a lot of matcha. Do you have a couple of other favorite teas that you recommend people play with in their cooking or cocktails?

Nicole:

Yeah, absolutely. There's a lot of different teas to choose from. I have Earl Grey, and it's definitely one that is kind of a classic flavor that has a citrus flavor to it, so it works well with a lot of things I definitely really like to use. There's a green tea from Japan called Hojicha, which doesn't at all taste like you would think a green tea would. It's really, like, dark and roasty super comforting. It's like one of my go to cheese in the winter when it's cold, and I love to especially like cocktails with whiskey. It works really well. It works really well with cinnamon also.

Nicole:

So definitely one of the recipes in the book combines hoji chop with cinnamon. It's definitely one of my favorite combinations.

Tricia:

Fun. There's one I've tried and played with. I subscribed to a box for a while called Shaker and Spoon, and they send you these fabulous cocktail kits that really kind of open up your whole world as far as flavor combinations. But in one of them, and I cannot pronounce the tea, and maybe you can help me, but I think it's spelled G-O-A. What is it? It's not a poet, but it's a dark roasty tea. Go chung. I'm going to butcher this. I'm really embarrassed to even try to pronounce it.

Tricia:

I'll have to Google it and see if I can find it. But it was one of those dark roasty. Like, you could almost compare it to coffee. If you're a coffee lover who wants to try tea, that's kind of how that one hit me. So tell me a little bit more about your favorite ways that you can infuse tea into your meals and maybe some fun tea and food pairings you've discovered along the way.

Nicole:

Yeah, I definitely really like to incorporate tea into quids of whatever recipe I'm making, whether that's water, milk, butter. You can infuse tea into any liquid. It doesn't have to just be water like you would for regularly brewing tea. So I like to infuse tea with butter and then use that butter to make cookies so that you get the flavor of the tea. You don't necessarily have to put the tea leaves into it, but it's a really fun way to utilize those flavors. I definitely also really like to infuse tea with milk to add a fun flavor to recipes that incorporate dairy as well.

Tricia:

Do you find that you use tea more in baking than, like, let's say, in cooking your various meals? Or have you tried incorporating tea into more savory and meals versus baking?

Nicole:

Yeah, it definitely lends itself well to baking, and I think the association of tea with sweets from afternoon tea definitely kind of plays into that too. But tea also works really well with savory things. There's a smoked black tea called Lapsang Suchang, and it's really, really smoked. So that one works really well with meat. So a lot of times I'll crush the leaves, use that as kind of like a part of a spice rub. There's also Japanese green teas also have a very savory quality. They tend to have a lot of umami, so it's like a savory sweetness. And so they also work really well for things like broths and soups because they do have almost like a saltiness to them.

Tricia:

Oh, my gosh, you've got my wheels turning about all the things that I want to try now because one of my favorite things to cook is a pork tenderloin, and I quite often do a rub that has like, coffee and chili powder and cocoa. But now I'm going to go find that tea and yeah, I'm excited to try that and see what happens. Or even use a Japanese green tea in some broth. It would be really interesting to see what layers of flavor that adds tea has such a distinct and I know they're all a little bit different, but they do have a distinct nose or aroma to them, too, that I think would bring in a whole nother level of interest to a dish. And that's one of the things I was really curious about, is how can I don't bake a lot, but I cook all the time, and so how can I play with it in that way? And that gives me some ideas to get started.

Nicole:

I'm excited to see what you make.

Tricia:

So along those lines, what's your top advice for someone stepping into the world of tea for the first time? Outside of the bagged? Teas and loose leaf tea. I know when you walk into a tea shop, it's exciting, but it can also be really overwhelming.

Nicole:

Yeah, it definitely can be very overwhelming. I definitely recommend that people start slow, buy small sample packs instead of going into a store and buying a pound of tea without knowing if you actually enjoy that tea at all. It also helps to keep in mind that the way that you prepare tea determines what it's going to taste like. So when you first try a tea, if you don't enjoy it, it's not necessarily the tea's fault. It may be how it's being brewed so you can play around with your parameters, like your water temperature, how much tea you're using, how much water you get to manipulate the taste to make it, how you would enjoy it.

Tricia:

Okay, so asking for a friend, let's say you get a little too obsessed and you buy way too much tea and you have it for a long time, does it expire or lose its potency?

Nicole:

It doesn't necessarily expire per se. As long as it's not exposed to, say, moisture, which would make it get moldy, it really won't go bad, but it definitely will start to lose its flavor over time. Generally, most teas you want to drink within about a year of purchase just to make sure that you are getting the flavor at its best. For teas that have passed their prime, a lot of times I'll use those to make iced tea because for iced tea, you're going to use more leaf volume anyway. Typically for iced tea, you would brew it double strength so that when you dilute it, it's not going to lose all of its flavor. So a lot of times those teas that are a bit older will still be perfectly good. For iced tea, where you may kind of miss some of that flavor if you're brewing just a single cup of hot tea.

Tricia:

Well, that little tidbit of information explains a lot about why I feel like iced tea never tastes as good as when I make hot tea. One, I'm sure it has to do with temperature of water, but I had no idea that you were supposed to double the volume, so that could have something to do with it. All right, well, in our last few minutes well, I did want to ask you. I keep seeing these ad for a company and I think they're called Magic Teas. Have you seen those? Are you familiar with that company? It's like a subscription, but they have teas based on your astrological signs and phases of the moon. The packaging is beautiful. It's not inexpensive, but I'm always intrigued by packaging. Packaging doesn't always really mean that it's really great tea, right?

Nicole:

Definitely, yeah. Buying tea can be a bit tricky that way, like an old adage in the industry that the less good the teen side will be. Sometimes you do get what you pay for if it comes in a super fancy box. In order to nape that price point, they probably do have to make some compromises on the quality of the tea. That will be the case, but a lot of times it is.

Tricia:

Well, I have one more question for you that's come to mind, as we've been talking before. I turn it over to you to tell us all things about anything that you have coming up or promoting, but you bring up a really good point. How does one who's buying tea, I mean, do you know if it's a good tea before you've tasted it? Are there telltale signs of good tea or better quality tea?

Nicole:

Yeah, that can definitely be difficult because there are so many types of tea. It can definitely help to just do a little bit of research, just like a quick search of the type of tea you're looking at before you do buy. That way you get an idea of what color the leaves should be, what shape the leaf should be. For example, like matcha green tea is very popular and there's so many different ones out there and a lot of them aren't super great quality. And one of the best ways to look at that is like, the color of the tea. You should have a really vibrant, bright green color if it's dull green, if it's dark, if it's dusty looking. That definitely tells you that, like, a lower quality tea smell can also be not necessarily what the taste will be, but you want your tea to smell fresh, especially a green tea. You want to have that smell as fresh as possible, where if the tea smells really old, it quite possibly is old and won't taste as good.

Nicole:

Definitely does depend on the kind of tea, though, because there's a tea called poir tea, which actually can be aged. So for that tea, sometimes older is better. So it very much depends on which tea specifically you're looking at.

Tricia:

I'm a big fan of the poir teas. I am not really sure what it is about them that makes me love them so much, but I feel like they have, I don't know, a really depth of flavor, maybe that is at the aging.

Nicole:

Yeah, absolutely. There's two different types of poor tea. So one is they refer to it as shun or raw pour, and that one's kind of closer to a green tea, but it's like really earthy and punchy. And then there's another type called showpour or cooked, and that one is actually artificially fermented, so it really makes the tea, like, super dark and earthy. That one's probably the one I think most people think of when they think of poor, because it's kind of like the one that's become most easily accessible until recently.

Tricia:

Very cool. So tell us how people can get in touch with you, where they can follow you, and a little bit about your Tea Recipe Book. This is your chance to really just bring people into your world and what it is that you're promoting right now.

Nicole:

Awesome. Thank you so much. Yeah. So you can find me at Tea For Meplease.com also on pretty much every social media platform as Tea For Me, please. Except for TikTok, I'm the real Tea For Me, Please, because somebody already took my name. I definitely I have a huge catalog of articles, product reviews that are there for you to learn from. I have hub pages like my Beginner's Guide to Tea that make it really easy to kind of dive in and get started. My inbox is always open, so I'm always happy to answer any questions that anyone has about tea.

Nicole:

Tea Recipe Book is a book that came out last year, a collection of 50 recipes for everything from brewed teas to lates cocktails, bubble tea, sweets, treats. There's pretty much something for everyone there. I also included a really thorough introduction to teas, so it's also a really great way to kind of just get yourself started on learning all of that information so that you know what to look for when you do head to a tea store.

Tricia:

Wonderful. I know. I'm definitely going to get a copy of the Tea Recipe Book. I'm super excited to try several of the things that we've talked about today. And thank you so much for being here with us. It's been fascinating to learn not only about the history, but I really as somebody who drinks a lot of tea, I learned a lot today, just in terms of I mean, I said I was asking for a friend, but I went through this obsessive stage and bought a ton of tea. And then I started drinking coffee again. And so I've been sitting here thinking, I need to get back to drinking more tea instead of collecting more.

Tricia:

So that was one of my questions and then just really excited to learn more and dig in and experiment with all the different ways that you can use it. And I hope that anyone who's listening feels inspired to get in touch with Nicole, but also start playing and experimenting with those teas that you have sitting around the house that they've been sitting around for a while. It's not just for drinking. You can try all the things and if you want to compare notes, then get in touch with me in the Show Notes. Or if you develop a great recipe, I'm sure Nicole would love to hear about it, but I definitely would love for you to share it with me. And we'll include all the links in the Show Notes and I will talk to you on the next episode. Thanks so much for listening and if you enjoyed this episode, please go hit that follow button. Subscribe leave us a review and if you're ready to change what mealtime looks like for you, breaking that cycle of chaos and having more fun in the kitchen.

Tricia:

Build some confidence and discover your love of cooking. Schedule your free dish with trish. Call at the link in the Show Notes. We'll chat a few minutes and you'll walk away with personalized strategies to take your mealtime routine, from tired to inspired. See you next time.